Debuff / Trait_none SKILLS

[Olympicus]

Хроники

1. Chaotic Throne: High Five

Исходники

Присутствуют

Сборка

L2jEternity

Hello everyone, i would like to know if anyone knows how debuff formula works on PTS HIGH FIVE or the correct official way to check / replicate it, because right know i have serious problems about it .
In particular, there is some debuff who have traits for example: sleep, bleed, shock,etc.
Let's say we take sleep example:
Skill Trance (ID 1394) if u are attacker and want to increase ur chance to land this skill u can use "Necklace of Valakas" this give u (p_attack_trait;trait_sleep;40).
If u are under attack and want to decrease chance of land u can use White Talisman of Attention this give u ( p_defence_trait;trait_sleep;10 ) .
Here everything is clear and all works ok.
But there is some skills (debuff ) with trait_none:
Example:
Curse Disease ( 1269 )
Ice Vortex (1340)
Seal of Limit (1509)
there is many of them and on game they are very popular, and here comes the doubt, what save you vs this skills ? what help to you on land this skills?
Most of player ( including me ) think antharas, zaken, mental shield help to increase/decrease chance on debuffs but lets check antharas earring skills.
Earring of Antharas Skill : "Increases resistance to earth attacks and bleed/shock/mental attacks, bleed/shock/mental attack bonus", if u check description of the skill mental attacks/defense are considering like "trait_derangement" (Skills with this trait : Fear type , Silence type ) and taking this on count trait_none skills should not be affected by antharas / zaken or even mental shield buff, so my theory is wrong? Also there is some skills with trait "DEATH" ( Curse of Abyss - 1337 ) and same problem, whats save you vs this skills ? what help to land this skills? how formula should work about this?
after a research i saw MEN and MDEF could help vs this, but this is for skills with trait derangement so its not clear for me, only this params help to decrease chance on none_trait / DEATH ?.
Any info about it will be really helpfull, thanks.

 

[Aristo]

trait_anything is just a word that links the attack and defense parameters. The word itself doesn't really mean anything. Each skill with the p_attack_trait effect adds a value to the total attack value, and each skill with the p_defence_trait effect adds a value to the defensive value. Further calculation comes from calculating the ratio of the attacking value to the defensive value, where 0.05 is the minimum value, and 2.0 is the absolute resistance.

Hello everyone, i would like to know if anyone knows how debuff formula works on PTS HIGH FIVE or the correct official way to check / replicate it, because right know i have serious problems about it .
In particular, there is some debuff who have traits for example: sleep, bleed, shock,etc.
Let's say we take sleep example:
Skill Trance (ID 1394) if u are attacker and want to increase ur chance to land this skill u can use "Necklace of Valakas" this give u (p_attack_trait;trait_sleep;40).
If u are under attack and want to decrease chance of land u can use White Talisman of Attention this give u ( p_defence_trait;trait_sleep;10 ) .
Here everything is clear and all works ok.
But there is some skills (debuff ) with trait_none:
Example:
Curse Disease ( 1269 )
Ice Vortex (1340)
Seal of Limit (1509)
there is many of them and on game they are very popular, and here comes the doubt, what save you vs this skills ? what help to you on land this skills?
Most of player ( including me ) think antharas, zaken, mental shield help to increase/decrease chance on debuffs but lets check antharas earring skills.
Earring of Antharas Skill : "Increases resistance to earth attacks and bleed/shock/mental attacks, bleed/shock/mental attack bonus", if u check description of the skill mental attacks/defense are considering like "trait_derangement" (Skills with this trait : Fear type , Silence type ) and taking this on count trait_none skills should not be affected by antharas / zaken or even mental shield buff, so my theory is wrong? Also there is some skills with trait "DEATH" ( Curse of Abyss - 1337 ) and same problem, whats save you vs this skills ? what help to land this skills? how formula should work about this?
after a research i saw MEN and MDEF could help vs this, but this is for skills with trait derangement so its not clear for me, only this params help to decrease chance on none_trait / DEATH ?.
Any info about it will be really helpfull, thanks.

That is, conditionally, you can make a defensive buff with the effect p_defence_trait;trait_monkey_ass;200 and a person with this effect will receive full resistance to skills with trait = {trait_monkey_ass}

 

[Olympicus]

That is, conditionally, you can make a defensive buff with the effect p_defence_trait;trait_monkey_ass;200 and a person with this effect will receive full resistance to skills with trait = {trait_monkey_ass}

Thanks for answer, i understand what u say, thats why also i provided this example of sleep, there everything works perfect, items / buffs who gives u resist attack work and take in count for calculate chance all ok there. The main issue is for debuffs skill who dont have traits, even if its like u say "just a word" something should help you to increase attack and defense vs this type of debuff and thats why am trying to looking for, of course acording to PTS or some trusted resource if possible.
Let's give an example:
Attacker Use Skill Debuff Curse Disease ( 1269 ).
Its only INT/MATACK involve on increase chance of landing calculate ?
in case of defender, its only MEN / MDEF involve on decrease chance?

 

[Aristo]

Thanks for answer, i understand what u say, thats why also i provided this example of sleep, there everything works perfect, items / buffs who gives u resist attack work and take in count for calculate chance all ok there. The main issue is for debuffs skill who dont have traits, even if its like u say "just a word" something should help you to increase attack and defense vs this type of debuff and thats why am trying to looking for, of course acording to PTS or some trusted resource if possible.
Let's give an example:
Attacker Use Skill Debuff Curse Disease ( 1269 ).
Its only INT/MATACK involve on increase chance of landing calculate ?
in case of defender, its only MEN / MDEF involve on decrease chance?

No. Level difference, attribute, matk\mdef, basic_property(if exist)
My java code for this calc for example.

 

[Projack]

No. Level difference, attribute, matk\mdef, basic_property(if exist)
My java code for this calc for example.

Отсюда сразу следующий вопрос, на чем базируется твой код? Есть сомнения в истинности java эмуляторов

 

[Aristo]

Отсюда сразу следующий вопрос, на чем базируется твой код? Есть сомнения в истинности java эмуляторов

Мой код базируется на моем умении пользоваться блокнотом, в котором я ради эксперимента меняю старые и создаю новые скиллы для ПТС сервера, с помощью которых я вполне успешно могу находить определенные закономерности и воссоздавать на их базе формулы. Ну и еще пара вещей, конечно же.

 

[Projack]

No. Level difference, attribute, matk\mdef, basic_property(if exist)
My java code for this calc for example.

При разнице уровней магии и цели в -3 отключается lv_bonus_rate. Откуда вообще взялось это число 3? Эмпирически? или это какой-то обще известный факт? Или это может быть и не 3

 

[LordWinter]

MasterToma help

 

[Aristo]

При разнице уровней магии и цели в -3 отключается lv_bonus_rate. Откуда вообще взялось это число 3? Эмпирически? или это какой-то обще известный факт? Или это может быть и не 3

Ну тут как. Какая-то часть кода реверсилась, какая-то заимствовалась у тех, кто отреверсил ее раньше, какая-то часть постигалась опытным путем. Я когда перепиливал у себя движок скиллов, столкнулся с тем, что довольно большой объем информации по формулам уже готов, разными кусками у разных команд. В первую очередь это разумеется L2j, которые довольно неплохо продвинулись по формулам, за последние пять лет. Осталось все это собрать в кучу, провести итоговые тесты, которые показали +- одинаковые результаты на ПТС и на моем коде, на выборке в 500 кастов, при абсолютно одинаковых персонажах. Также, при изменении указанных в формуле параметров, результат менялся опять же и на ПТС и на моем коде примерно одинаково, что позволило сделать выводы, что формула относительно корректна. Я допускаю, что учел не все параметры, но те которые можно относительно достоверно измерять, учтены по большей части.

 

[Olympicus]

If the difference between the levels of magic and the target is -3, lv_bonus_rate is disabled. Where did this number 3 come from? Empirically? Or is this some well known fact? Or it might not be 3

in fact when we speak about it, there is some randoms numbers added to the base chance (+3, +30.0) why? i dont know) i saw this on others assambly also

Well, here's how. Some part of the code was reversed, some was borrowed from those who reversed it earlier, some part was learned by experience. When I was rewriting my skill engine, I came across the fact that a fairly large amount of information on the formulas is already ready, in different pieces for different teams. First of all, this is, of course, L2j, which have advanced quite well on the formulas over the past five years. It remains to put all this together, to conduct final tests, which showed + - the same results on the PTS and on my code, on a sample of 500 casts, with absolutely identical characters. Also, when changing the parameters indicated in the formula, the result changed again both on the PTS and on my code in approximately the same way, which allowed us to conclude that the formula is relatively correct. I admit that I did not take into account all the parameters,

in any case, thanks for sharing our experience and formula i will take a look also checking this debuffs manually on PTS by try/error experiment, cuz looks like thats is the only way to get something similar or compare about it.